CITY OF
SOUTH LYON
REGULAR CITY COUNCIL
MEETING
December 10, 2007
Mayor
Doyle called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m.
Mayor Doyle led those
present in the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag
PRESENT:
Mayor Doyle
Council Members:
Kivell, Maida, Morelli, Selden and Wedell
City Manager Cook
Attorney Lee
City Clerk/Treasurer Zemke
Department Heads: Collins,
Renwick and Martin
ABSENT:
Council Member Kopkowski
APPROVAL OF MINUTES:
Councilman Wedell stated
that on page 6, the motion for the Repurchase Agreement does not indicate who
made the motion and second.
Clerk/Treasurer Zemke stated that she would check the record and insert that
into the minutes.
Councilman Selden stated
that his comment regarding Colonial Acres should reflect that Colonial Acres is
a cooperative not a corporation.
CM 12-1-07- APPROVAL OF
MINUTES – NOVEMBER 26, 2007
Motion by
Kivell, supported by Selden
To approve the
minutes of the regular meeting of November 26, 2007 as corrected
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
APPROVAL OF MONTHLY
BILLS:
Councilman Morelli
questioned the payment to DeMaria Building Company.
City Manager Cook stated that this payment was for the Treatment Plant.
We are trying to close out this project.
Councilman Morelli
questioned the payment for carriages.
It was stated that this was for the Holiday Spectacular.
Councilman Kivell questioned
the payment for a transformer at the Wastewater Treatment Plant.
Superintendent Martin stated that on August 24th we had a
large storm which took out our #1 transformer at the Water Plant.
The total cost is approximately $51,000.
City Manager Cook stated that the insurance company did cover the cost.
We made the payment and we were reimbursed by the insurance company.
CM 12-2-07- APPROVAL OF
MONTHLY BILLS
Motion by Wedell,
supported by Morelli
To approve the
monthly bills as presented
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
APPROVAL OF AGENDA
Mayor Doyle asked, in the
absence of Council Member Kopkowski, did Council wish to proceed with discussion
of the City Manager’s goals. He stated
that he has received Council Member’s comments, but he would like to review them
before discussion. Council Member Maida stated that she would like this
delayed until Council Member
Kopkowski can be here. Councilman Kivell stated that he did receive
comments from her.
He further questioned why Council did not simply bring the comments to
the meeting and have a free discussion.
Mayor Doyle stated that it was discussed and agreed that they would be
compiled as a single list. The
consensus was to leave the item on the agenda for further discussion.
CM 12-3-07 – APPROVAL OF
AGENDA
Motion by
Morelli, supported by Maida
To approve
the agenda as presented
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED (1 opposed)
CITIZENS SUGGESTIONS:
Carol Nonis of 61376
Creekview Drive stated that her subdivision, Brookfield Subdivision is off of
Nine Mile across from Centennial Middle School.
She stated she should have been here months ago, however she viewed the
last City Council meeting where the issue of lowering the speed limit on Nine
Mile was discussed. The speed limit
is not the issue. The issue is the
flashing cross walk sign, which is not enough, it needs to be red so that the
children trying to cross can press the button and the drivers will stop.
She stated that her daughter has been almost hit on more than one
occasion. She stated that she is
terribly upset. It should not
matter if it is one kid crossing or ten.
They need to get across safely.
She is willing to do whatever it takes to get this done.
Chief Collins stated that
the signal is to call attention to the crosswalk.
It is not possible for that type of signal to be a red flasher.
It is not a traffic control device, it is a warning device.
It would require a whole new traffic study by the traffic engineers to
determine if an additional traffic control device is warranted.
Discussion was held on the traffic study.
Chief Collins stated that it is very statistical and black and white.
Ms. Nonis stated again the
flasher needs to be red. Councilman
Kivell stated that we put that signal there for the kids.
It would seem that anyone with common sense would see the flasher and
take note that someone is walking there.
Ms. Nonis stated that when a child is hit, it is going to be a problem.
A lot of people do not stop; why take a chance.
Councilman Kivell stated
that he does not have a problem with it, but we could have an analysis done that
would indicate that this is the route we should take.
He questioned whether we could be overly cautious and make a move to do
that. Chief Collins stated that we
could override the traffic engineers, but he would be cautious about doing so.
Discussion was held on the studies.
Chief Collins stated that the speed study was done prior to changing the
speed limit and the gap study was done during school.
He would have to check the records, but he believes the study was done
both in the morning and afternoon.
Ms. Nonis asked what it is
going to take to get this done.
Mayor Doyle stated that he has heard that there are others that feel the same
way, and Ms. Nonis is the first to come before Council.
He further stated that it is not going to be accomplished tonight.
He stated that has been out there and he does not think it is warranted.
The problem got put into play by the School District with putting two
middle schools there, but we do not have any control over that.
Councilman Kivell further stated that nobody can even go 35 miles per
hour when kids are going to school.
Mr. Mark Nonis of 61376
Creekview stated that he picks his daughter up from school every day.
People do go 35+. He stated
that police officers are there sometimes by the public walk.
Once people see that then you see the tail lights come on.
He stated that he has actually stopped in the middle of the traffic to
let a kid cross. People do not see
the school zone sign. They are talking on their cell phones, etc. The kids go
back to basketball games, etc. outside of the school hours.
The concern of the police officers is moving the people along that are
parked on the approach, not about a kid getting hit.
Chief Collins stated that the reason the officers are down there is that
the parents back up so bad on Nine Mile that they go from the driveway of
Centennial all the way to the marked crosswalk and create a vision issue.
Mr. Nonis stated that we
have young families in these subdivisions that are trying to get across to play
on the playground and they have a hard time crossing.
He would suggest either red lights or a walkway over the road.
Mr. Wendell Welper of 22205
Quail Run Circle stated that he would like to make three comments regarding the
last meeting. He stated that with
regards to the MERS benefit, he would like to see this policy changed so that
our grandchildren are not paying that bill.
Secondly, he noticed that the City Manager approved the expense of
$19,000 for the tower repair that is over and above his position and he feels
that it should be identified what amount he can authorize.
Lastly, with regards to the streetsweeper, he asked why the City has to
borrow money for it; do we not have a City fund that we could use.
Mayor Doyle stated that as
far as the service credit for Mr. Haas, we do not have a policy in place. We
have addressed these on a case by case basis.
The only other ones eligible would be Mr. Cook and our Fire Chief Craig
Kaska and we will address that at the time.
Mayor Doyle stated that as far as the streetsweeper, we do have a capital
improvement fund and there are times that we pay cash for certain items, and
other times borrow money. In this
case, the interest rate was very good, and we do not want to pay cash for
everything leaving nothing for a rainy day fund.
Further, the City Manager, in the case of an emergency, does go through
and contact Council. Sometimes
there just is not time. It is not
done in a vacuum. In general, he
can approve up to $5,000. Attorney
Lee stated that if Council later decided that an expenditure was inappropriate,
Council could refuse the writing of the check and the individual would either
have to sue the City Manager or the City.
Councilman Kivell stated that we have confidence that his judgment would
never put us in that type of position.
The only reason that the question was raised was the process.
Councilman Wedell stated
that he would like to briefly address the Nine Mile issue.
He stated that what was brought up at the last meeting was a suggestion
that the speed limit was too high.
The issue being brought here tonight is an entirely different issue.
He would be willing to look at this and give the suggestion some
consideration. Mr. Nonis stated
that all they are asking for is something to protect the children whether that
be a police officer crossing the kids, red lights, etc.
He stated that there use to be a crossing guard.
It was stated that was when it was an elementary school.
Mr. Nonis stated that it is not just the Centennial kids but also
Millennium and families that try to get across.
Councilman Selden stated
that he did vote for lowering the speed limit.
There has always been a traffic problem in this area.
Mr. Scott Brown of 504 W.
Liberty stated that about two years ago W. Liberty and Hagadorn were torn up
because of the new construction behind them.
They were told at that time that they would be putting in new streets.
City Manager Cook stated that it is not scheduled within our projects for
next year. Mayor Doyle stated that
every year we target a number of different local streets.
Mr. Brown stated he has
noticed recently in the South Lyon Herald that a number of businesses recently
have gone under, he is sure that a number of issues played a factor.
However, since he is a resident of South Lyon and a business owner, it is
his personal belief because he loves the City, he tries to keep his business and
money within the City. He recently
put a bid in with the City and it was given to a contractor from another area
and he was distraught about it.
With the taxes he and his wife pay so that we can have the services, it is
disconcerting to him. He does not
feel that the City is doing enough to encourage growth for our local businesses.
When he provided his proposal, he was put aside for someone who was
cheaper. The question was asked of
Mr. Brown what his proposal was for.
Mr. Brown stated that is academic at this point and irrelevant.
Councilman Kivell stated
that if we can find a contractor who can perform the same task for less money,
it is Council’s duty to save our taxpayers money.
If it is a minute amount of money, that is different.
Lyon’s Marketplace closing has nothing to do with us or the way he
operated his business. He further stated that he does not know the particulars
of the closing however, the notion of Council being somehow responsible for the
failure of this business is a lark.
Mr. Brown stated that is not what he is saying, but he is looking to this
Council to generate activity so that the local business owners can do business.
He stated that he loves living in the City, but a neighbor living three
blocks away has the same services, but he pays $5,000 more per year in taxes
because he lives in the City.
Because he is a small business, he does business in South Lyon, but when he goes
to the City with a qualified bid and it is dismissed, it is disturbing.
He further stated that he does not even know where to bid.
He called Steve Renwick to find out.
He further asked how to get on a bid list.
It was stated that we collect names on a regular basis for all sorts or
different work and you can request to be added on.
Mayor Doyle stated that you can put together a business package as far as
what services you have to offer and send it to the DPW.
Mayor Doyle stated that
projects come up on a regular basis.
Council does make an effort to keep the money local.
We have an obligation dealing with taxpayers’ money to spend it wisely.
If there is a differential for like services, we are obligated to take
the low bid. Regarding Lyon
Marketplace, the situation is very sad and the business owners poured their
hearts and souls as well as money into the business, and it just did not happen.
Further discussion was held
on the bidding process.
Superintendent Renwick stated that when he talked with Mr. Brown a few days ago,
he did give him the necessary information how to get on the bid list.
Attorney Lee stated that the law requires us to advertise for bids and
also accept the low bid unless there is some basis for rejecting the lowest bid.
Generally, the reason for rejecting the low bid is because the lowest
bidder is unqualified to do the work.
Otherwise, it is required by State Law to accept the low bid.
Further discussion was held on looking at local businesses and State Law
requirements.
Councilman Selden stated
that he has over 35 years in industrial purchasing, and municipal purchasing is
not much different. You have to
look at the best value for the money for qualified services.
Mr. Gary Butler of 879 West
Hill Drive stated that he thinks that there is more the City can do for local
businesses. He has talked with a
number of Council Members, the City Manager, etc.
In his position as President of the Chamber of Commerce, part of their
business is promoting businesses in the City and surrounding communities.
There are some things we would like to do and the Chamber is putting some
of that together. The other side is
the businesses are equally guilty of not taking advantage of the opportunities.
He stated that part of what we are trying to do is a live here, shop here
initiative. There is over 1.5
billion dollars worth of income in this community, and a lot of that is not
getting spent here. A lot of that
is incumbent on the business owners.
This is a bedroom community, but yet how many businesses are actually
open when people are at home, for example.
He discussed some of the downtown activities such as the Holiday
Spectacular and the Downtown concerts.
We need to do more both on the governmental side and the business side.
He hopes that everyone listening will think about where they are doing
their Christmas shopping.
OLD BUSINESS:
1.
Second Reading: The following ordinances are proposed for second reading-
a.
Sign
Ordinance- Chapter 70, Section 70-2 Definitions
Attorney Lee stated that
there have been no changes since the first reading.
The question was asked as to
when the ordinance will take effect.
City Clerk/Treasurer Zemke stated that it will take effect 10 days after
adoption and publication.
Discussion was held on those
signs that will be grandfathered.
It was stated that the most egregious offender has had signs for quite some time
so they will probably not go anywhere any time quickly.
CM 12-4-07 – SECOND
READING – CHAPTER 70 – SIGN ORDINANCE – SECTION 70-2
Motion by
Kivell, supported by Selden
That this be the
second reading and adoption of an amendment to Chapter 70 – Sign Ordinance
Section 70-2 –
Definitions (see attached amendment as part of these minutes)
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
b.
Chapter 102- Section 102-293 and Section 102-323 – Veterinary Clinics
Attorney Lee stated that all
that is being done with this amendment is moving language from one section of
the zoning ordinance and placing it in another to make the use a Special Use as
opposed to a permitted use. It was
stated that it imposes some limitations that do not exist in the existing
language.
CM 12-5-07 – SECOND
READING – CHAPTER 102 SECTION 102-293 AND SECTION 102-323
Motion by
Selden, supported by Kivell
That
this be the second reading and adoption of an amendment to Chapter 102 – Section
102-293
and
Section 102-323 – Veterinary Clinics (see attached amendment as part of these
minutes)
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
c.
Chapter 86- Subdivision Article III Section 86-62 Streets
Attorney Lee stated that
this is the same as the first reading and requires sidewalks to be installed on
one side of the street along private streets as well as public in new
subdivisions.
Councilman Morelli stated
that he has a concern that the language indicates condominiums rather than any
residential development. Attorney
Lee stated that there are only two ways to develop a subdivision.
You can go through the plat procedure in which case the streets are
public. Or, you can go through a
condominium development, where the streets can be either public or private.
Councilman Morelli asked about situations such as Colonial Acres or
anything else. Attorney Lee stated
that an apartment complex for example would require a site plan in which the
Planning Commission can require sidewalks.
We are talking about subdivisions that are created under our subdivision
Act and there are only two kinds.
Pam Weipert, Planning
Commission Chairperson stated that what they were trying to do was to close a
loop-hole for new subdivisions.
Currently, the ordinance requires sidewalks on both sides of a public street and
does not require any sidewalk if the streets are private.
Most of the land in the City is built-out with a few remaining, difficult
to develop properties. People are
using creative ways to put homes on those parcels.
They wanted to ensure that there would be a sidewalk included on the
plan. Further, they are asking that
a sidewalk be required on one side of the street rather than two.
The intent of this ordinance was for subdivisions built, not other types
of development.
CM 12-6-07 – SECOND
READING – CHAPTER 86 - SUBDIVISIONS
– ARTICLE III – SECTION 86-62
Motion by
Morelli, supported by Wedell
That this be the
second reading and adoption of an amendment to Chapter 86- Subdivision
Article III
Section 86-62 Streets (see attached amendment as part of these minutes)
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
d.
Rezoning Request- 23238 Pontiac Trail- RM-1 to B-3. First Reading held on
10/22/07
Attorney Lee stated that
this is simply a map change to make sure a piece of property has the same zoning
on the entire site. In this case,
part of the parcel is RM-1 and part B-3.
This makes the entire parcel B-3.
CM 12-7-07 – SECOND
READING – REZONING REQUEST 23238 PONTIAC TRAIL – RM-1 TO B-3
Motion by
Kivell, supported by Maida
That this be the
second reading and adoption of an amendment to the zoning map rezoning 23238
Pontiac Trail
from RM-1 to B-3
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
2.
Goals- City Manager
Mayor Doyle stated that we
have received some recommendations by Council Members.
He stated that early in the fiscal year, Council discussed setting annual
goals for the City Manager.
Councilman Wedell stated
that according to the minutes, Council was to give their suggestions to the
Mayor and to compile them. Mayor
Doyle stated that he has not received them from everyone.
It was stated that some
suggestions are being seen for the first time and some have yet to be submitted.
Furthermore, Council Member Kopkowski is not present.
The suggestion was made to table the issue.
CM 12-8-07 – TABLE CITY
MANAGER GOALS
Motion by
Selden, supported by Maida
To table
discussion on the City Manager goals until the next meeting
The request was made that
the Mayor email the suggestions to all of Council prior to the meeting so that
everyone has a chance to review them.
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED (1 OPPOSED)
3.
Proposed Utility rate increase- Water/wastewater
City Manager Cook stated
that based on the audit and recommendation of the auditors as well as comments
made prior to that, he has provided an explanation as to why he has brought back
the proposal. He is asking Council
to increase the rate for water by $ .17 per thousand gallons and $ .33 for
sewer. Right now, the rates do not
generate sufficient funds to operate the system including capitalization of the
equipment. This is a reasonable
request and we can come back with a re-evaluation as we progress through the
system.
Councilman Wedell stated
that the request is to increase from the current $4.11 per thousand gallons to
$4.61 per thousand gallons used which is a $ .50 increase.
He thanked the City Manager for the back-up material.
Council Member Maida stated
that she is totally against this increase.
We have given all of the employees raises, we are buying new equipment,
etc. Now we are talking about
raising rates for citizens in our already struggling community.
She stated that there are other ways that we can look at our funds and
find something else we can do instead of burdening our community.
As a Council Member and citizen, she does not need a raised bill.
She stated that she is completely opposed to this.
Councilman Selden asked if
there is legislation that requires that the City operate at a break-even point,
requiring us to raise the rates.
Attorney Lee stated that you cannot run the water and wastewater treatment
plants at a deficit. You are
obligated to have it break-even.
You are not to make a profit, but you cannot operate at a deficit.
Furthermore, when you start supplementing from the General Fund, you have
additional problems. You have to
set the rates so that you do not burden the rest of the budget process.
You are running the plants as a utility, not as part of the General Fund
of the City.
Councilman Wedell stated
that this is an enterprise fund and should be run as a business.
Our auditors pointed out to us last fall that the water and sewer have
fallen behind the past two years in spite of the increase that was approved last
year. As much as all Council has an
aversion of raising rates, this is an obligation we have to run this enterprise
fund as a business. We cannot let
it take a loss. Under State Law,
the State could require us to do a deficit elimination report.
City Manager Cook stated
that we are not charging the residents of the community everything that we could
be. For example, we presently have
a General Obligation for the filter system that we put in 2000, but we have yet
to levy the millage. We are using
tap-in fees to pay that debt. That
was a conscious decision we made.
The fact is that our rates do not cover the cost of the operation.
The increases that the employees are getting, for the most part, are
based on our collective bargaining agreements.
Obviously, everyone does get some kind of increase on an annual basis.
That applies to both private and public sector.
Down the road, we may be forced to levy that additional millage if we
continue to use those fund balances, and we have a legal right to do so.
That was a voter approved millage.
Council Member Maida asked
why we would not be reaching out to Lyon Township and letting them tap in.
City Manager Cook stated that there are a lot of practical issues
associated with that including keeping control over our utility system.
Mayor Doyle stated that once we open up our utilities to Lyon, Green Oak
and Salem Townships, we lose control over our utility.
Councilman Kivell stated that any reach outside of our corporate limits,
we no longer have control. He
further stated that that was a conscious decision so that we would not put
ourselves at jeopardy in providing service to our own population.
Council Member Maida
questioned whether taking money from the people in our own community that are
struggling makes more sense than to share services.
Councilman Kivell stated that clearly there are people in bad times, but
he does not feel that is the general demeanor of our entire community.
This is the most fair way to operate because it is user driven.
If you use water, you pay for water.
The alternative is that we pay through our tax dollars for someone using
water.
Mayor Doyle reviewed the
rates of utility costs in other communities with their own systems, with South
Lyon being the lowest. City Manager
Cook stated that these are all systems controlled by the respective government
units independent of the Detroit Water system.
They have their own water and sewer system.
Their populations vary, but these are comparable size communities.
City Manager Cook stated
that as unpopular as this may be, we need to operate efficiently or this system
will falter. You do not shut the
system off because you do not have any more money.
The devastation if we could not provide utilities would be catastrophic.
Attorney Lee stated that if we were to take the suggestion to not raise
our water and sewer rates and subsidize water and sewer from the General Fund,
you would have the same people that is being suggested that they are so hard
pressed, subsidizing the Tube Mill and all the other industries in town that use
a great deal of water. By saying
not raising the rates is doing them a favor, you are not because you are using
tax monies to subsidize industrial user’s water.
The point in having water and sewer pay for itself is that users of water
pay appropriately depending on how much water they use.
Council Member Maida asked
if there is any way to reconsider talking with Lyon and Green Oak Townships.
Attorney Lee stated that in addition to the annexation issue, the other
problem to keep our water infrastructure cheap for our citizens, we have gone to
the general bond fund to subsidize our water and sewer with General Obligation
Bonds, not Water and Sewer bonds.
If we go outside our limits, our citizens would help subsidize Lyon Township or
Green Oak Township residents.
Councilman Morelli stated
that he was told that if we offer services outside our boundaries, then we have
to offer it to whoever asks us.
Attorney Lee stated that State Law states that you can only charge 1 ˝ times
what internal people are paying.
The problem with that is if you extend a major water or sewer line, the cost to
do that is enormous and there is no way to structure the water and sewer billing
to recoup the cost.
Mayor Doyle stated that Lyon
Township is making strides with their own water and sewer.
There are certain pockets, Woodland Drive for example, that are
surrounded. They have been given
the option that if in the future their septic fails, etc. they can annex, but
that would be voluntary. Our system
was designed to support what we have, not the masses.
City Manager Cook stated that we only added 1 million gallon per day to
our plant for the fact that we are not going to extend out beyond our corporate
limits. The threat exists that once
it goes outside, it could be extended at their leisure and that would use up our
capacity. We would have to increase
that capacity.
Councilman Selden stated
that the fact of the matter is that we are 30% below any other communities.
We are getting a very good buy for very good water.
He does not like price increases, but this increase is not a lot of
money. We are required to do this.
Superintendent Martin stated
that he was recently visited by engineers representing Lyon Township as they are
looking to expand their sewage treatment plant on 10 Mile.
If we go outside the community, we would be opening it up not only to
homes, but also industry. Our plant
was designed for a bedroom community, and we could end up dealing with
industrial waste coming into the plant, etc.
Attorney Lee stated that in
the City, there is an average of 80-90 feet between homes, in the Township the
average is 200-400 feet between houses.
That is a lot of pipe to pay for and maintain.
People would never understand why they would be charged more than someone
living in the City.
Discussion was held on
increases in energy costs.
Superintendent Martin discussed the increase in usage during the summer months
and the fact that those energy costs follow the same curve.
Councilman Kivell read some
comments provided by absent Council Member Kopkowski.
He stated that she first asked that the item be tabled for further
discussion and study. She indicated
that she feels that other alternatives should be investigated such as the sale
of service under contract to residential and commercial properties outside the
City limits. The previous
discussion with the City Attorney dealt with concern with the inability to annex
after said extension of services.
She feels that we need to look at what is actually, realistically going to be
annexed now providing services. The
possible reallocation of costs presently burdening the Water and Sewer
Departments – Councilman Kivell stated that what she meant by that is the
vehicles that are used for DPW activity and Water and Sewer more heavily lean
the budget to the DPW side. Council
Member Kopkowski’s comments indicated that if it is found that the rate increase
is the only solution, she would propose a decrease in the collective millage to
offset on a one-to-one basis.
Councilman Morelli stated
that as much as he hates to raise people’s expenses, he does not see any way
around this increase. He discussed
the possibility of looking at alternate sources of power.
He stated that he recently viewed a television program on windmills.
Discussion was held on the cost.
CM 12-9-07 – INCREASE IN
UTILITY RATES
Motion by
Selden, supported by Morelli
To increase the
water and sewer rates by increasing the water to $1.57 per thousand gallons and
sewer
to $3.04
per thousand gallons
ROLL CALL VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED
Kivell – Yes
Selden – Yes
Doyle – Yes
Wedell – Yes
Maida – No
Morelli - Yes
4.
Resignation- Jennifer Salvatore from Parks & Recreation Commission
Mayor Doyle stated that
Jennifer Salvatore has served on the Parks and Recreation and has done a great
job, but is looking to spend more time with her family.
CM 12-10-07 – ACCEPTANCE
OF RESIGNATION
Motion by
Morelli, supported by Maida
To accept the
resignation of Jennifer Salvatore from the Parks and Recreation with thanks
VOTE:
MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
5.
Possible re-evaluation of FY 08-09 street improvements
City Manager Cook stated
that there were comments at the last meeting that possibly some of the streets
that were discussed did not need to be done at this time.
We try to move the projects around the City so that we are not in the
same neighborhood all the time. We
could look at going back to the Norchester area and come up with the same
project costs that we originally proposed.
We could eliminate Reynold Sweet and Ten Mile, Scott and McHattie, and
the engineering would be the same.
The question was asked if we
have to spend that much money. City
Manager Cook stated that we either do it now or later.
If we do a reasonable amount each year, we will not have a large proposal
to maintain the streets. We try to
keep pace over the years and we have been doing it for roughly this amount of
money through our Capital Improvement Fund.
People can see where their tax dollars are going because we are improving
neighborhood streets and some of our major streets.
Discussion was held on the
condition of the Norchster/Winchester area.
Councilman Morelli asked how
the roads are determined. City
Manager Cook stated that we look at the streets and ask the engineers to give us
an estimate. The engineers are the
experts and they are the ones that make the determination as far as the
condition of the roads. Discussion
was held on past projects and trying not to target the same areas year after
year.
Discussion was held on the
Hagardorn and Liberty area. City
Manager Cook stated that these are roads Council can look at, but it looks
decent. There are patches in the
area and we could mill it.
Councilman Kivell stated
that there is a wide spread of damage in the Norchester area.
The intersection of Ten Mile and Reynold Sweet had some “alligatoring” on
the northbound lane of Reynold Sweet, but it still has plenty of miles yet.
The notion of repairing the entire intersection because of the left turn
lane did not seem to be justified.
Abel Street is a must. The
intersection of 11 Mile and Eagle Heights is in rough shape, but past the
boulevard it is fine. With these
economic times being what they are and the fact that it has plenty of life left
before it becomes something that needs to be tended to, he does not see how it
can be justified. He stated that he
would be okay to eliminate what has been suggested and not adding, but he is
okay with adding it as well because they are in rough shape.
Councilman Kivell read
comments provided by Council Member Kopkowski indicating that the streets that
she brought up at the last meeting do not need to be done or done so extensively
as suggested including Eagle Heights, E. Liberty, Scott, northern section of
Reynold Sweet and the alley should be capping only.
In addition, she feels that the additional streets as indicated in the
City Manager’s memo do not need to be placed on the list this time, keep the
money in the general fund for now and the engineering award should be amended.
City Manager Cook stated
that if we do not do the Norchester area now, we are going to need to do it next
year. They are breaking up and the
joints are in bad condition. This
would be the same as was done on a small portion of Norchester.
We would have to repair any base failure and overlay.
This is not general fund money, but rather capital improvement money that
are funds earmarked for this type of work.
Councilman Morelli stated
that what he has been hearing is that it is not so much the roads, but the
economic times and the money that is being spent.
City Manager Cook stated that the same argument could be made for the
next several years. However, he
feels that we have an obligation to maintain our streets and put money into
streets so that the residents can ride on streets that they pay taxes on.
These funds are earmarked for this.
You cannot take these funds and pay someone’s wages; it is for
improvements. This is a reasonable
proposal. Mayor Doyle stated that
if we do not do it, nobody else is going to do it for us.
Furthermore, this is not going to put us in jeopardy and we could have
done a lot more than what has been proposed.
City Manager Cook stated
that there is an alternative. These
are local streets and we could talk about special assessments.
This is not necessarily a general obligation of the City to do these
projects. Nobody wants to pay a
special assessment. We have been
able to do this with the funds that have generated.
Discussion was held on the
options. Mayor Doyle stated that he
is happy with what has been proposed.
City Manager Cook stated that we could do Winchester and Mayfair and add
a number of streets at an estimated cost of $260,000 and the engineering would
be the same for design purposes. We
would replace those streets with the other streets that Council does not feel
need to be done. We would still do
the area of Eagle Heights to the first culdesac.
He further stated that we are going to have to come back next year in the
same area and continue doing some of the work.
You cannot do it all at one time.
Mayor Doyle stated that
during budgeting, Council was asked to make suggestions on road improvements for
preparing this list. He stated that
we are in good financial condition.
Discussion was held on the uncertainty.
Councilman Kivell stated that the intention is to let people understand
that they are making deliberate decisions, not just spending money because we
have it. Councilman Wedell stated
that this was not a concern when we overpaid for park land or paying for
military time.
Councilman Selden stated
that you have to have preventative maintenance on the roads.
We do not want to spend money prematurely, but you do not want to wait
too long that it will cost more.
City Manager Cook stated
that he is simply providing an option to modify the proposal and still spend
roughly the same amount of money.
The engineers have looked at the Norchester area and have indicated that those
roads need to be dealt with. These
are intended to be maintenance projects in order to get a useful life of the
surface for 5-10 years. You can
leave the project as it is or take the alternative.
Council Member Maida stated
that she would prefer to do Wellington/Norchester area.
Councilman Kivell concurred.
Councilman Wedell stated
that he does not have a problem with changing the proposal as long as we are
exchanging like for like.
CM 12-11-07 – FISCAL YEAR
2008-09 STREET IMPROVEMENTS
Motion by
Kivell, supported by Morelli
To modify the FY
2008-09 Street Improvement Project by eliminating E. Liberty – Reese to Reynold
Sweet, Scott
Street – Elm to McHattie, and do the entry of Eagle Heights at Eleven Mile and
the north
section of
Reynold Sweet and add the equivalent amount of work to the Wellington/Norchester
area
Mr. Brown asked if W.
Liberty and Hagadorn is being proposed.
City Manager Cook stated that is not on the list.
VOTE: